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Change to UMS Fees Structure

YCBA Response To UMS Change Proposal

David Guild guildbridge1@gmail.com
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9:48 PM (25 minutes ago)
to patrick

Hi Patrick
At our Away Day last week, our YCBA Board considered the explanation of possible EBU Board adjustment to UMS calculation - as set out in the Updates from Aylesbury dated 6 March.
We raised a number of matters and asked me (DG) to write back to you and broaden our reply to our Yorkshire clubs who have already been contacted by you and to additionally place this response on the County to County Forum for wider discussion.
DG started by saying that he would have much preferred that County Chairs/Boards had received prior notification of UMS new methodology approach being considered. This is because UMS is a highly sensitive topic that needs careful change management and should not be a stone thrown into a still pond by a general news item. To issue in this manner may very well be misinterpretted as intent rather than a possibility. We seem to have not yet learnt the lessons of the last major change to funding method in 2010/11.
DG further said that it is very difficult for any club to give an opinion as to the efficacy of the "flat fee + xpence/Board" approach without a charging framework. (Rather like being asked to comment on ordering decision for home underfloor heating without knowing costs and efficiencies).
It certainly is not a consultation document without this financial framework.
Fortunately, the EBU Competitions Committee did make an explicit proposal to the EBU Board in January 2024 and this was agreed to be pushed out for consultation. The UMS proposal is for a flat rate of 23p plus a linear rate of 1p/board per person/session.
Based on this precise figure, DG calculated the financial impact as attached sheet 1.
The YCBA considered first the overall concept. Comments were:
1. This sounds complex and overkill. From a club and player perspective the player fees are fixed across a wide range of regular play boards so why have one part of the table money fee so convoluted.
2.There is no known "pain" being signalled by the clubs, so why amend the process entirely? What is the overriding objective? To make black pointed competitions cheaper? If overall EBU revenue remains neutral is more money to be taken from regular club play?
2. At present UMS, TD Fees, Green and Blue Point licenses et al do not have a consistent charging thread. TD Fees for example, increase in 4-board steps and colour coded competitions are on a per table fee rate. If a major change is envisaged, should all fee types be synchronised at this time? Perhaps a common multi-step approach in 4 or 6 board ranges may have merit but it is unproven.
The Board considered then considered the figures in Sheet 1.
From April 24, the UMS is 45p. The Board first considered this against the proposed new method. The Board concluded the new model logic to be flawed as there is not a plateau distribution to boards played; instead there are distinct peaks and troughs and these need to be weghted in a financial model.
The majority of regular club play is around the 24 to 27 range and here the UMS fees will move up sustantially. Some clubs, particularly smaller clubs already under pressure, operate entirely in this range and would be penalised.
The Board eventually decided that the fee rate cannot be meant to apply to 2024-25 as there would be a substantial £000's windfall to the EBU, so estimated a 47p UMS rate for 2025- 26 and applied it there. This looked more financially palatable (and may reduce EBU income?) but has fundamental structure issues.
These being:
1. Clusters of play - see Sheet2 - Analysis of Feb 24 Sessions at Olicana BC. The clusters are: low number of boards for beginners/early players (8 to 16), less boards (18 to 20) for online play as 2 hours/session is usually the limit, a regular higher range for standard club F2F play (22 to 27). It seems overcomplex to differentiate within each cluster
The future will see the ultra-low board count for lower duration games offered daily, such a one hour games and DIDO. A new fee structure would need to accommodate these without penalty.
2. Far Greater Complexity
Current UMS is based on sessions rate 2/3, 1 or 2 times usually at 1 times rate. The difference between Boards in play and the count of those played is not usually a problem as both are usually in the same fee band.
Treasurers get simple statements showing the number of sessions in each charging band and this is based on Boards in play.
However...
As Sheet 2 shows the boards in play can be substantially different from number played. If there is an uneven number of pairs,not all players reach the same number of played boards in the session. Also, if not all the boards are played by every pair in a movement, the diifference can be great (eg 30 in play with 16 played by each pair).
For this reason, sessions will need to be broken down into pairs charging.
Club charge statements will have to radically change and it is difficult to envisage how a Treasurer will be able to validate any fee invoice.
Also, there is a software development cost and delay to create such a radically new financial charging system.

It is for these reasons that the YCBA Board reject this new approach to "flat fee and per board rate" for UMS charging.
Regards
David Guild
For the YCBA Board Response

Comments

  • UMS Change Proposal Impacts Sheet1
    UMS Boards 23p+1p /board Present Change year 25/26
    Played 44p Now 47p est'd Change
    one third 4 27 29.3 -2.3 31.3 -4.3
    one third 8 31 29.3 1.7 31.3 -0.3
    one third 12 35 29.3 5.7 31.3 3.7
    1* 15 38 44 -6.0 47 -9.0
    1* 16 39 44 -5.0 47 -8.0
    1* 18 41 44 -3.0 47 -6.0
    1* 20 43 44 -1.0 47 -4.0
    1* 24 47 44 -3.0 47 0.0
    1* 27 50 44 6.0 47 3.0
    1* 28 51 44 7.0 47 4.0
    1* 32 55 44 11.0 47 8.0
    2* 36 59 88 -29.0 94 -35.0
    2* 40 63 88 -25.0 94 -31.0
    2* 50 73 88 -15.0 94 -21.0
    2* 60 83 88 -5.0 94 -11.0
    2* 70 93 88 5.0 94 -1.0
    3* 72 95 132 -37.0 141 -46.0
    3* 75 98 132 -34.0 141 -43.0
    3* 100 123 132 -9.0 141 -18.0
    3* 120 143 132 11.0 141 2.0

  • Analysis Of Olicana Sessions Feb 2024 Sheet2
    Each session was analysed as Boards In Play – Boards Played.
    So, 28-24 is 28 Boards in play of which 24 were played by a player.
    Sessions were also coded as F – F2F, O- Online, B – Beginner, G – Guided slow
    Sessions were :
    27F-24, 25F-20, 20O-20.18G-14,24F-24, 28F-24, 30G-16, 21O-18,24F-24, 14B-8,24F-21,
    20O-20,28F-20, 22G-16,24F-24,24F21,24F-24,20O-20,24G-16,24F-24,20F-18,27F-26,22G-14,
    25F20,27F-24,25F-20,20O-20,26G-14,24F-24,27F-27,26G-14, 18O-16,24F-24,24F-24,25F-25, 22O-20
    Differences between hands in play and those actually played can be substantial . See Guided play.
    The hands played break down as:
    Cluster 1 Beginners & Guided Play 8boards x1, 14 x4, 16 x4
    Cluster 2 Online play 18 x2, 20 x9
    Cluster 3 Regular F2F play 21 x2, 24 x11, 25 x1, 26 x1, 27 x1

  • Two quick points: 30 boards in play of which 16 are played by each pair does not meet the 70% rule. The proposal is that the payment per board is for the number of boards played by each pair, not the number in the movement. Yes, it would charge for 24 boards if some players sat out for two of them, but not for 32 boards if no-one played more than 24.

  • Hi Gordon
    Apologies if the movement contravenes the rules. This was the most extreme example I had of the difference that can occur between actual hands in a one club for one month snapshot. The session was for guided play aimed at recently graduated students and I don't think that Master points and NGS would have been front of mind.
    Best regards
    David

  • edited March 27

    The important point is that they would not be charged for 30 boards but for 16, which would be less than at present.

  • Thanks Gordon for clarification but at present, whether they play 30 or 16 boards, they get charged the same under our present method. It is simple and does not have the complexity of analysing played board counts of each individual pairing.
    Has the method of charging when robots are used been considered yet?

  • I'm not sure why it is desirable for 16 board games to be charged the same as 30 board games, and for 36 board games to be charged twice the amount of 35 board games. It is certainly the case that at present some clubs will run a special game as 35 boards rather than 36 to avoid doubling the UMS charge, even if the 36 board format would be more convenient.

    It's also misleading to talk of "the complexity of analysing played board counts of each individual pairing": clubs would just make their UMS submissions as at present and all that aspect would be worked out automatically.

  • Hi David
    Thank you to you and the board of YCBA for taking the time to make your report. Most of which I understand and frankly agree with. I got lost on the schedule of stats but I think that may be because I couldn't fathom the format or column headings.
    To The EBU Board
    I note that the first time that anything about changes to the structure of the calculation of "UMS" is in the unagreed minutes of the EBU Board on 18th January 2024.
    Para 8.2 UMS Fees.
    "We have a UMS fee set by the shareholders at the AGM (currently 44p to rise to 45p in April) and for
    some time we have had a policy of charging 36-72 boards at double rate and giving a 1/3 discount
    for sessions of 14 boards or fewer. Currently a club submitting for a session is paying from
    2.75p/board to just under 0.8p/board. Being able to charge fractional pence per board is an issue for
    some of our processing systems, but an alternative which works easily is charging a flat rate (say
    23p) plus 1p/board.
    The Board discussed the issues with the current arrangements, and the potential alternatives. It was
    agreed that while the alternative mentioned above was “fairer”, on any change there would be
    some losers and some winners. The Board agreed to make the County Associations and clubs aware
    that we were looking at this, and to invite their thoughts."

    So the questions are. What are the issues with the current system? How did they come to light? What were the other "potential alternatives"? Why was the selected change considered "fairer". David mentions that the "Competitions committee" did make an explicit proposal to the EBU Board in January 2024 and this was agreed to be pushed out for consultation. I have been unable to find any Competition committee meeting minutes (either agree or waiting agreement). So like David and YCBA feel a little in the dark as to what and where we are going with this change. Are we resolving a problem with the change or are we merely solving a symptom of the problem and ignoring the problem completely.

    If there are difficulties in the current processing systems in dealing with fractions of a penny how will we deal with any furture increase? Who will agree the increase?

    Frankly, discussions on the number of boards played/in circulation seems pretty meaningless and a diversion from the discussion that is needed.

    At the end of all discussion any changes have to be "sold" to the playing members. Asking for thoughts without making the facts availble is almost like saying "this will happen, we just need to give you time to get used to it".

    I am all for positive and reasoned change, so let's have a structured debate in the appropriate place at the appropriate time.

    This is my opinion and has not been discussed with any committee.
    CMOT

  • Sorry - I've been very slow in getting around to answer this. Seems to be lots to do sometimes and I have been playing too much bridge (I am told).

    1. The background to the question was not explained in the brief notes given. The background is that with the current options there is a cliff-edge on session size which is believed can unnecessarily distort the planning for a competition, and arguments are being put forward to change the thresholds. Some clubs are running shorter sessions than before, and some charge less to members for shorter sessions. In this context, it seems only right to consider more flexible schemes for setting UMS rates, and the idea of an amount changing with the number of boards played is a natural extension of the current arrangement whereby the UMS amount paid by an individual rises as they play more sessions. The idea is being postulated rather than planned.

    2. A question was raised about "the efficacy of the approach". I welcome thoughts as to how the efficacy would be measured. In my mind there are two aspects - one is the practicality (that the calculation and payment collection are easy) and the other is fairness (who benefits most pays most). Are there others? As indicated in the original, the intent is to collect the same amount of membership fees from the players - and some players/clubs will end up paying more and some less than currently. That is true for any change, and cannot be a reason to treat the current position as set in stone.

    3. In terms of the practicalities - as every session is submitted to the EBU, the number of boards played by each player is known and calculating that player's UMS charge is straightforward, and the total charge for the session would be set against the club or county account exactly as at present. No action would be needed by a club were this to be implemented, except for the treasurer who needs to check that the charges are correct - and to help with that a table can be provided where a simple look-up provides the required check.

    4. In terms of fairness, it is surely unfair that a session which runs to 15 boards rather than 14 sees an increase of 50% in the UMS charge, and a change from 35 to 36 boards doubles the charge? These anomalies disappear with the new proposal.

    Be assured that nothing is yet settled, and any change would need to be ratified at the November 2024 AGM and would not come into effect until April 2025.

    BTW - there was no Competitions Committee involved in this thinking.

    Patrick

  • Hi Patrick
    Thank you for your clarifications.
    I must say that when I originally raised the YCBA response on this matter, it was to the original draft minute from the January Board meeting. This included mention that the Board considered the proposal to reset UMS at 23p plus 1p per board and the Board agreed to push this out for consultation.
    I now see that this minute has changed. There was now no proposal made and the Board reached the flat rate option of 23p+1p per Board by a process of osmosis. Also, the intent is now not to “consult” but to “advise that the Board are looking at this area and to invite thoughts”. A process lower on the decision inclusion scale.
    Although this muddies the water, I recognise that these are draft minutes and the Board are within their rights to amend any minute’s wording and intent until it is finalised.
    That being said, a lot has already been written and your clarification re-iterates one side of the argument. Certainly, Gordon is concerned that some clubs manipulate their competition board count to avoid a UMS hike.
    My main concern is that whilst UMS technically can be totally flexed, clubs are unlikely to have such variability on their overall table money. Clubs that have regular 24/27 sessions will feel the pinch and there may be a considerable backlash (Possible exit of some clubs, particularly mainly smaller clubs with already fragile finances)
    My second concern is that this seems a very complex solution to a problem that is not proven or at least does not seem to be major.
    If we started from day one with this flexed system and the EBU charged all players directly, then it would be a “fair” system and concerns raised on this Forum would vanish as it would be “fairer”. But this is not the reality. To reach this position disrupts the current Club processes and needs careful change management.
    This of course assumes that the technical changes necessary to install flat rate plus per board fee would be light. If they are not, then it is a non-starter or as the Americans say, “The juice is not worth the squeeze”.
    Assuming, that software development is minimal, then there is nothing to stop parallel running of the last month’s UMS data under the current and proposed charging system before any commitment decision is made to change. The impact on individual Clubs and Counties could be shared and a fully informed discussion actioned before a point of irreversible implementation is reached.
    To me, that seems to be the next step forward.
    Regards
    David

  • @00403545 said:
    Certainly, Gordon is concerned that some clubs manipulate their competition board count to avoid a UMS hike.

    I don't see it as manipulation. Clubs are entitled to make decisions in their own interests. What I am concerned about is to have a system that doesn't put them in this position, so they can decide on the format that suits them and pay an appropriate amount for it.

    Assuming, that software development is minimal, then there is nothing to stop parallel running of the last month’s UMS data under the current and proposed charging system before any commitment decision is made to change.

    This would tell us nothing, since it would be based on the formats used under the current UMS arrangements, not on the formats that might be adopted under a changed system.

  • Hi Gordon
    Surely pre-commitment parallel running would provide a better picture than no data at all.
    It would only be massively out from true if the change to charging resulted in a wholesale clubs adoption of different board played numbers per session.
    I doubt this would be the outcome.
    Club Board numbers per session depend on the time available and the speed of players, not the charging method.
    Club open competitions having more boards played are a far lower number and they can be isolated from the regular play stats.
    It would be risky if not foolhardy to adopt such a radical charging system without a steer on outcome.
    Regards
    David

  • Following on from Davids' final comment April16th

    1) It would appear that most years the UM is increased by a penny (there are some moans but usually the increase is voted through). If the manner of charging is going to be a set figure (say 23 pence, plus 1P per board played) then adding a penny to that 23 pence each year does not produce a level playing field with the extra income that would be required to meet a 46 pence charge. How are you going to sell a 2 pence increase (that is likely to produce more income than the normal penny) to the playing public?

    2) As David says for a set number of tables there are several movements that result in different numbers of boards being played. Isn't it likely that many smaller clubs (or even the bigger clubs) will start playing movements that fit the time allowed and involve people playing a lesser number of boards. Then slow play is no longer a worry to the club or director, it just means reducing the number of rounds played. After all most people want the social aspect as well as playing bridge. Time could be taken up with longer breaks for tea/coffee/wine.

    As I have asked before , what problem is being solved? Is this sugestion just dealing with the symptom of a problem and leaving the problem to develop more symptoms on its own? Saying it will be income neutral for the EBU might actually be counterproductive in future years, Bridge players have long memories.

    Has the NGS run its course just like it was thought that masterpoints were no longer the "thing" prior to 2010? Will players want the same process for the county subscriptions? What knock on effect will there be to the Green Point (and Blue point) Licencing fee income?

  • In my local area there are several bridge clubs, but only ours is in the EBU - so there is a lot of competition for players.

    Our table money is £3 per person per session. The UMS is a huge proportion of our income and we cannot afford to increase costs as there are plenty of other places to play in the £2-3 bracket.

    I would estimate that only 10-20% of our members are interested in the NGS and Masterpoints - born out by the numbers that talk about it, take part in county/national games and those that are totally at a loss when we run a handicap event.

    Any additional costs would put us under further pressure to reconsider membership of the EBU.

    In terms of 'fairness', the club does not set the movement and then charge table money, we charge a flat rate of £3 and the movement is set based on numbers/time. There is no consideration that those sessions of 20/21 boards are being unfairly charged as other sessions get to play 27/28 boards for the same prices. Mainly because the players in those sessions are looking for different things out of their sessions, but still use the facilities of the club.

    Perhaps the 'unfairness' of the cliff-edge pricing point would be to reconsider that part of UMS, rather than a wholesale change to the system?

    How much money does the EBU gain from that current price increase in UMS? If that price increase were minimised, could that be net-neutral - where the income from current 36+ board sessions is reduced, but the number of 36 board sessions increases? I doubt it, because I doubt that many clubs would want to run a 36+ board session other than possibly once per year events?

    I think that the 'unfairness' of the system is inherent in the whole concept of it.

    Clubs have flat fees for playing in their events, to have a flexible cost to run any given event that is not directly proportional to the number of paying players is inherently more complex. When a club is considering their financial position - what the membership costs should be, what the table money should be etc, that is currently easy. We can look for any expected large changes in members/player sessions and see if there is a shortfall and requirement for an increase. As our club has ran for years, we can easily look at last years figures and if there is higher expenditure than income we need more income, if there is a surplus of income, we are okay. If UMS were to change, we would then need to start looking at how many boards are played in our sessions to work out if we are going to be one of the winners, or one of the losers.

    To put this into perspective, I am playing roughly 80-90 sessions per year - around £40 of UMS. For that, I get to use this forum, play in some county events when I am available, get to look at NGS after events and collect Masterpoints for promotion every few years.
    Membership of Badminton England gives access to club/league badminton and public liability insurance, plus more, for £15.
    There is an additional level of membership for another £15, for the more competitive circuits/competitions.

    In all my years of playing badminton, I have never heard anyone complain that they pay £15 to Badminton England, but their club only has one session per week, whereas another club has 2 sessions a week and still only pay £15. Or that their club only has a 2 hour session, where other clubs have 3 hour sessions.
    Similarly, I have not heard a single person complain that their 20 board session is £3 where another session is 28 boards, for the same price.

    Where UMS pricing is causing an issue (with sessions with very few boards or lots of boards), this is a natural consequence of charging members per session, for an organisation that is not directly involved in the running of that session.
    If membership were a flat rate of say, £20 per year, clubs would just add that to their membership costs. Then nobody would even think that they are only playing in those 14 board sessions and no director would consider not playing that perfect 36 board movement because of costs.

    I know that a few local clubs dropped out of the EBU because of UMS. Our club had a vote (to my memory) 6 or 7 years ago about whether to leave the EBU or not - it was a close run thing and the remainers just won out. Introduce more complex/more expensive UMS and I would expect that we would have another vote and who knows the outcome when UMS is clearly our club's largest single expense?

    So, I would exercise caution before proceeding with a change for what is purported to be income neutral, for fear of losing yet more clubs and making it more difficult to attract new clubs in future. The EBU website under 'Find a Club', lists 9 clubs in the whole county - I know of 8 more within 10 miles of my house that are not EBU registered, 3 of which I know used to be affiliated.

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